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2434d · Capitalism
Beef is too good. Your not taking my hamburgers.
anarchovegan
replied 2434d
You value your taste over the lives of animals who want to live?
replied 2435d
In this case yes. Farm animals only exist to be farm animals. They have been bred to that purpose. If we didnt raise them for food they wouldnt exist.
anarchovegan
replied 2434d
Animals Are Bred To Be Killed
replied 2434d
...the rest of our own species. Our moral obligation to another is defines by our relationship with that other. If you dont assign a hierarchy then you have little moral grounding.
anarchovegan
replied 2434d
You don't need to view non-human animals as morally equivalent to humans to give them the basic decency of not paying others to kill them when they want to live, for your taste.
replied 2434d
Killing is part of life, and it is morally wrong to raise animals to the level of human. It is equivalent to reducing humans to other animals. It diminishes the relationship with
anarchovegan
replied 2434d


replied 2433d
It is actually fun to respond to his videos and explain why his premises make his arguments fail. He is logically valid, but the false premises lead to his false conclusions.
anarchovegan
replied 2433d
What are the false premises that make it morally OK to pay other human animals to kill non-human animals that want to live?
replied 2434d
The relationship between hunter and prey, or farmer and farmed, are very different from human and companion animal. That said we could still eat a dog if we were starving.
anarchovegan
replied 2434d


replied 2433d
This guys arguments fail because he relationship between humans is different than between human and animal. His logic fails because of he premises he uses.
anarchovegan
replied 2433d
That the relationship between human animals and non-human animals is different means it's ok to pay other people to kill non-human animals?
What are the faulty premises?
replied 2433d
Yes, but what I was saying is that because of the difference in relationship his comparison cant work. It was a valid comparison, to something incomparable. More of a false equivalency
anarchovegan
replied 2433d
Animals aren't the same as humans. Does that means it's OK to pay others to kill them?
replied 2433d
Yes
anarchovegan
replied 2433d
Why?
replied 2433d
The relationship between hunter and prey, or farmer and farmed, is not one that obligates the hunter/farmer to want to keep the other alive. It is a natural relationship.
anarchovegan
replied 2433d
... Interesting response.
... Why/how do you think such a relationship is natural?
replied 2433d
Predator and prey relationship is almost as old as self moving animals. Once there were several types we saw predator and prey relationships arise. That and family are the most natural
anarchovegan
replied 2432d
replied 2432d
Triggered by what appeared to be a woo-woo link,
http://truthseeker.se/humans-are-naturally-plant-eaters/
but the reality is the link is factually correct and balanced.
Cheers
anarchovegan
replied 2430d
That's a fairly normal cognitive dissonance response :)
replied 2432d
We are best suited for running down prey, and working together against larger prey. Eyes in the front of our heads, and our teeth also point to our predatory nature.
anarchovegan
replied 2430d
replied 2429d
Whatever they could get their hands on. Some ate mostly meat. Some ate mostly fruit. All ate whatever they could in order not to starve to death.
anarchovegan
replied 2428d
Yep!



replied 2428d
He frames the issue of aliens in that last video very poorly. It isn't a matter of letting. The moral obligation between hunter and prey, or farmer and cattle, are very little, if any.
anarchovegan
replied 2428d
If we were predators and needed to eat animals to live, I'd agree.
You have not substantiated/established that we humans are hunters, nor that animals are our prey.
replied 2428d
Need is irrelevant. We are more scavengers and hunters. Our species were great hunters during prehistory. Human actions that are prehistoric are natural actions.
anarchovegan
replied 2427d
Yes, we can excel at things that aren't natural for us:
https://steemit.com/health/@johnblaid/are-we-really-designed-for-eating-meat
Prehistoric = natural? How? Why?
anarchovegan
replied 2427d
How is need irrelevant?
anarchovegan
replied 2430d
TIME: Sorry Vegans, Meat Made Us Human Response

Humans are Herbivores in Denial - w/ Science!
replied 2432d
That said cultivation is natural for us as well. Farming produce and livestock. Using other species to help isn't only for humans. Other great apes steal wolf pups for protection.
anarchovegan
replied 2430d



replied 2429d
I use to work in a pig slaughter and cutting plant. I use to contemplate the hanging hogs as humans, and us some aliens that farmed humans for meat. I didn't have a problem with it.
Dr. Uther 1MBFpC
replied 1450d
.
anarchovegan
replied 2428d
Why not?
replied 2428d
Some animals eat other animals. That is not something for us to approve of, or not. It is simply a fact of life. I dont have a problem with it because I dont see it as a moral issue.
anarchovegan
replied 2428d
Other animals, such as cats and lions, are obligate carnivores.
It is immoral to feed them a vegan diet.
replied 2428d
Bad comparisons. People point to animals to show something is natural. Not moral. He confuses the issue. It isn't immoral to kill to eat. Starvation and need are not required.
anarchovegan
replied 2427d
Would it be immoral if someone killed you to eat you?
replied 1449d
Yes, of course. We are both human in that scenario.
replied 1450d
Yes. Humans are not allowed be eaten, according to the bible.
replied 1450d
??????????
replied 1450d
How would you feel if you were hanging from a meathook
replied 1449d
I use to think about it that way. What if it was an alien plant for processing human meat. It was an interesting place to work. Its good to learn where your food comes from.
replied 1449d
Yeah, you think it's okay to have humans as food for aliens, that is what you said. Yet somehow I am unhinged for not believing in your climate change nonsense?
replied 1448d
I was actually saying it's not right for humans to eat humans. Its not immoral for animals, or in that example aliens, to eat humans.

This is no way can be related to climate change.
replied 1448d
That's like saying it's okay to eat dolphins or monkeys...
replied 1448d
Not exactly. Its just saying humans eating humans is wrong, but other creatures eating humans is not a moral issue. Rules about specific animals are additional rules.
replied 1447d
Yeah if the alien is a dinosaur or some other animal on another planet, yeah that will probably eat you, but I do not think aliens eat humans.
replied 1447d
Oh, wait, are you concerned by the reference to aliens because it disrespects aliens? Is this a belief that more intelligent creatures would have a moral obligation to eachother?
replied 1447d
Stop trying to troll me Sam, aliens aren't going to eat you.
replied 1447d
Why are you treating it as a moral issue then?
replied 1448d
One is a philosophical position on the morality of meat eating, and the other is a recognition of the data on climate change. We directly measured how much added CO2 was fossil fuels.
replied 1448d
You should look up the Swanson effect, soon solar panels will be in the KW range. Emissions won't be an issue in the future.
replied 1448d
It is parallel to "Moore's Law" that the number of transistors on an integrated circuit doubles roughly every two years.
replied 1448d
It's been predicted that by 2025 we will have computers that can think faster than the human brain.
replied 1448d
Sometime after that we will have a computer that makes decisions for the government. Kind of like a king, and so history will repeat again
replied 1448d

Governing People (Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy entry)
42,989 viewsOct 28, 2016

1K

21
replied 1448d
Solar panels will never absorb more energy than the sun puts down per unit area. More likely never beyond 50% of that power per area.
replied 2434d
He anthropomorphized animals a bit much. Dogs were not bred to fight, some are raised to fight, which is wrong considering the relationship between dogs and humans.
anarchovegan
replied 2434d